Ok, I am all for removing that exception, many churches already file their financial disclosure for transparency purposes, and I don’t like the idea of this loophole being used for greed.
I have no issue removing the tax status of churches that violate the political clause, and also fully support ending the financial disclosure exemption for churches.
So good to be in agreement!
edit: fucking lemmy, I concede every point and still get downvoted. This is why you will fail
Secular charities aren’t telling people that they are doomed to hell unless they follow their rules and worship their god. Hence the need to pay. Change their tax status.
Incorrect, churches were historically the first service hubs in most communities, and many continue to do so
Food outreach, emergency economic relief, free childcare services, and more
Look I get you enjoy being an edgy little atheist but that doesn’t give you the right to ignore the massive amount of good churches do every day in communities across the world.
Not true and I actively worked at a church that provided food outreach to anyone that came to their doors, and considered anyone suggested by a church member for financial relief (there has to be some limits, the funds are not infinite)
Sure not every church does, but I’ll tell you this that any church that only provides services for their members is ignoring some of Jesus’s most important teachings and I will never support such an organization
You cannot discount all the good because of the bad, it creates a false image of their contribution to the cohesiveness of this country and I am telling you RIGHT NOW that if you want ANY hope of the U.S. coming out of this even SLIGHTLY then you will need to sit beside progressive theists because we ALL have a common enemy and your marginalization is going to hamper that (I don’t just mean you, I mean ALL heathens)
The charity provided is oftentimes contingent on worship, therefore not it’s truly public. Even if that’s not always the case, if it’s done once to one person, then it’s not public. Have whatever ideology you like. That’s not my issue. It’s a free country. Where’s the hypocrisy in wanting religious organizations that generally creep into business and politics to pay taxes? That’s nonsense.
Furthermore, how the hell does paying taxes cripple you? People of low economic means pay more taxes than churches.
People like you are eager to throw the baby out with the bathwater and that shows how little nuance you allow and just how broad that brush you use to paint over everything is
You say ‘is often times’, and then declare it all to be truly not public, you say ‘if everyone can’t be helped it’s not public’, why are you so fuckdamn eager to discount every good deed based on your gut feeling of the incidence of self-serving intent? It’s basically pathologic to think that way about such a large, ununified patchwork of fuzzy boundaried sects as somehow all being corrupt and self-serving.
The simple fact is churches across the nation do more charity work than you can even imagine but you won’t ever bother learning that nuance b/c the ‘god hates fags’ sign wavers have convinced you that that’s what ALL Christians are like
You don’t know anything about me buddy. You should chill.
I don’t have any problem with charitable works by you, your church or anyone else. All I said is churches should pay taxes. And they should. You’re complicating it way more than my intent, to the point that I’m now supposed to be bigoted and pathological. Lmao. Get a grip.
Churches also do a hell of a lot of damage too. Heck no one is perfect. I never insinuated getting rid of organized religion. But since you’re suggesting throwing out the baby with the bathwater, then I wholeheartedly agree.
On the contrary, I’ve seen the shape of your arguments hundreds of times and spoken many of them myself in my ignorant and heady days of youth
You saying ‘all I said is churches should pay taxes’ is you saying that you want to bar some of the most established charities in the U.S. from benefiting from the same programs that any other charity can participate in based on your dislike of their ideology and that IS bigoted af, the literal definition of it.
I bet you don’t bitch about the Satanic Churchs’ various tax exempt churches, because their ideals of heathen sacrilege appeal to you, and you are so far up your own ass you don’t see how that makes you a hypocrite.
Sure churches do a hell of a lot of damage, I’m not denying that and I personally dance for joy for every corrupt and disgusting church leader jailed and wish that everyone would STOP protecting them. This isn’t exclusive to churches. THIS HAPPENS in EVERY place that power shields people from criticism. There are more per capita child molesters in Hollywood than in the Vatican and you KNOW this to be true
I don’t want ANY abuser protected, but you are deluded if you think this is exclusively or even mostly a church thing. It is an abuser thing, and abusers actively seek out power and because capitalism it has become normalized to ignore their foul deeds
If you want to remove the financial disclosure exemption for churches, and tax those who refuse to comply? SURE I’m ALL for that. I fully support that
But insisting that all churches are corrupt money laundering operations because of the rancid actions of the few is disingenuous and fueled by antitheist bigotry
Again you don’t know anything about me. Seems like you have a lot of prejudiced opinions though and simultaneously are openly and repeatedly calling me a bigot. Which is hilarious.
Churches, synagogues, satanic temples, mosques, any and all should pay taxes. Religion shouldn’t be tax-exempt . I don’t care what flavor.
It’s not anti-theist. It’s being fair. You want to exist, and preach the word of your holy book. Then pay taxes.
Oh you do charity that benefits any and everyone? Then discount that off the tax bill. That simple.
I hope you find whatever is actually bugging you and put it to rest. You shouldn’t be this intense about a random internet person’s opinion.
They do other charitable work that isn’t handing out donated food. There is of course expenses associated with storing and giving out that food as well.
You’ll be furious to know that the workers are almost entirely volunteers as well. The cost to the church directly is negligible. And I’m still sure whatever other charitable work they do would not be significantly impacted by paying taxes. If anything, the money generated could do infinitely more good in expanding welfare programs. Charity is a band aid, not a solution.
My mom ran one for over a decade. You might be surprised to find out your assertions are not correct in my experience as the people running food banks are in fact paid.
The US social net was built around religious charity and it is sophomoric to presume the state would utilize increased tax revenue to replace what was lost.
If they operated full time as a food bank and didn’t proselytize to the people they are helping, then they shouldn’t pay taxes. If they preach and try to convert people to their religion during their service, then I’m going to bet they try to do that to the people they feed. Preying upon people in their weakest moments is not a good thing to do, but it’s all I’ve ever seen Christians do
Edit: “Marianists emphasized the power of small communities to “renew Christianity” following the French Revolution.” If this is their emphasis, then they should definitely be paying taxes.
ok so the issue is your disdain for religion. You would be fine with a different food bank not paying taxes but only because they share your lack of faith.
Yes. I’m not sure why you seem confused. The premise is churches should pay taxes. I’m not sure what you don’t understand about that. They should pay taxes. They are influencing people’s opinions on our politics and policies. They should pay taxes. They are influencing people in their weakest moments. They should pay taxes. Do you understand that I believe any religious institution should pay taxes? I hope you aren’t confused still.
Anarchist groups do the sane thing so Food Not Bombs should pay taxes then and do less charity.
All your leftist charities do everything you state churches are doing. Should your local mutual aide org get taxed because they influence people’s views?
The real issue here is your bigotry against churches.
This is actually really cool. Cooler if maybe they can pay taxes next!
Churches aren’t tax free because they are churches, they are tax free bc they are charities, just like every other charity out there
False. They are exempt from having to even prove the money is being used for charity… because they are churches. Unlike every other nonprofit.
Ok, I am all for removing that exception, many churches already file their financial disclosure for transparency purposes, and I don’t like the idea of this loophole being used for greed.
I have no issue removing the tax status of churches that violate the political clause, and also fully support ending the financial disclosure exemption for churches.
So good to be in agreement!
edit: fucking lemmy, I concede every point and still get downvoted. This is why you will fail
Secular charities aren’t telling people that they are doomed to hell unless they follow their rules and worship their god. Hence the need to pay. Change their tax status.
Philosophical position about the rules of a hypothetical afterlife doesn’t have any impact on whether a charity is a charity either
Can you not see your hypocrisy for wanting to cripple a public service because you don’t like its ideology?
Churches are not a public service.
Incorrect, churches were historically the first service hubs in most communities, and many continue to do so
Food outreach, emergency economic relief, free childcare services, and more
Look I get you enjoy being an edgy little atheist but that doesn’t give you the right to ignore the massive amount of good churches do every day in communities across the world.
… Exclusively to their church members. C’mon, that’s low hanging fruit.
Not true and I actively worked at a church that provided food outreach to anyone that came to their doors, and considered anyone suggested by a church member for financial relief (there has to be some limits, the funds are not infinite)
Sure not every church does, but I’ll tell you this that any church that only provides services for their members is ignoring some of Jesus’s most important teachings and I will never support such an organization
You cannot discount all the good because of the bad, it creates a false image of their contribution to the cohesiveness of this country and I am telling you RIGHT NOW that if you want ANY hope of the U.S. coming out of this even SLIGHTLY then you will need to sit beside progressive theists because we ALL have a common enemy and your marginalization is going to hamper that (I don’t just mean you, I mean ALL heathens)
Calling me a heathen and I’m the bigot? There’s no need to disparage atheists or non-believers.
And yes it’s for church members, like don’t even pretend. I don’t get why y’all have to lie so much if you supposedly have god on your side lmao.
Ok well good night. I’m done entertaining your trollish delusions.
The charity provided is oftentimes contingent on worship, therefore not it’s truly public. Even if that’s not always the case, if it’s done once to one person, then it’s not public. Have whatever ideology you like. That’s not my issue. It’s a free country. Where’s the hypocrisy in wanting religious organizations that generally creep into business and politics to pay taxes? That’s nonsense.
Furthermore, how the hell does paying taxes cripple you? People of low economic means pay more taxes than churches.
People like you are eager to throw the baby out with the bathwater and that shows how little nuance you allow and just how broad that brush you use to paint over everything is
You say ‘is often times’, and then declare it all to be truly not public, you say ‘if everyone can’t be helped it’s not public’, why are you so fuckdamn eager to discount every good deed based on your gut feeling of the incidence of self-serving intent? It’s basically pathologic to think that way about such a large, ununified patchwork of fuzzy boundaried sects as somehow all being corrupt and self-serving.
The simple fact is churches across the nation do more charity work than you can even imagine but you won’t ever bother learning that nuance b/c the ‘god hates fags’ sign wavers have convinced you that that’s what ALL Christians are like
And that’s pretty bigoted of you
You don’t know anything about me buddy. You should chill.
I don’t have any problem with charitable works by you, your church or anyone else. All I said is churches should pay taxes. And they should. You’re complicating it way more than my intent, to the point that I’m now supposed to be bigoted and pathological. Lmao. Get a grip.
Churches also do a hell of a lot of damage too. Heck no one is perfect. I never insinuated getting rid of organized religion. But since you’re suggesting throwing out the baby with the bathwater, then I wholeheartedly agree.
On the contrary, I’ve seen the shape of your arguments hundreds of times and spoken many of them myself in my ignorant and heady days of youth
You saying ‘all I said is churches should pay taxes’ is you saying that you want to bar some of the most established charities in the U.S. from benefiting from the same programs that any other charity can participate in based on your dislike of their ideology and that IS bigoted af, the literal definition of it.
I bet you don’t bitch about the Satanic Churchs’ various tax exempt churches, because their ideals of heathen sacrilege appeal to you, and you are so far up your own ass you don’t see how that makes you a hypocrite.
Sure churches do a hell of a lot of damage, I’m not denying that and I personally dance for joy for every corrupt and disgusting church leader jailed and wish that everyone would STOP protecting them. This isn’t exclusive to churches. THIS HAPPENS in EVERY place that power shields people from criticism. There are more per capita child molesters in Hollywood than in the Vatican and you KNOW this to be true
I don’t want ANY abuser protected, but you are deluded if you think this is exclusively or even mostly a church thing. It is an abuser thing, and abusers actively seek out power and because capitalism it has become normalized to ignore their foul deeds
If you want to remove the financial disclosure exemption for churches, and tax those who refuse to comply? SURE I’m ALL for that. I fully support that
But insisting that all churches are corrupt money laundering operations because of the rancid actions of the few is disingenuous and fueled by antitheist bigotry
Again you don’t know anything about me. Seems like you have a lot of prejudiced opinions though and simultaneously are openly and repeatedly calling me a bigot. Which is hilarious.
Churches, synagogues, satanic temples, mosques, any and all should pay taxes. Religion shouldn’t be tax-exempt . I don’t care what flavor.
It’s not anti-theist. It’s being fair. You want to exist, and preach the word of your holy book. Then pay taxes.
Oh you do charity that benefits any and everyone? Then discount that off the tax bill. That simple.
I hope you find whatever is actually bugging you and put it to rest. You shouldn’t be this intense about a random internet person’s opinion.
Would you want a food bank to pay taxes?
This is a post about churches.
I know. They are also functioning as a food bank. They are a non-profit acting in a charitable manner.
Do ypu think they should engage in less charity so they can pay taxes?
I dunno about other churches but I’m pretty sure the one I grew up in gave away donated food. Paying taxes wouldn’t impact that at all.
They do other charitable work that isn’t handing out donated food. There is of course expenses associated with storing and giving out that food as well.
You’ll be furious to know that the workers are almost entirely volunteers as well. The cost to the church directly is negligible. And I’m still sure whatever other charitable work they do would not be significantly impacted by paying taxes. If anything, the money generated could do infinitely more good in expanding welfare programs. Charity is a band aid, not a solution.
My mom ran one for over a decade. You might be surprised to find out your assertions are not correct in my experience as the people running food banks are in fact paid.
The US social net was built around religious charity and it is sophomoric to presume the state would utilize increased tax revenue to replace what was lost.
If they operated full time as a food bank and didn’t proselytize to the people they are helping, then they shouldn’t pay taxes. If they preach and try to convert people to their religion during their service, then I’m going to bet they try to do that to the people they feed. Preying upon people in their weakest moments is not a good thing to do, but it’s all I’ve ever seen Christians do
Edit: “Marianists emphasized the power of small communities to “renew Christianity” following the French Revolution.” If this is their emphasis, then they should definitely be paying taxes.
ok so the issue is your disdain for religion. You would be fine with a different food bank not paying taxes but only because they share your lack of faith.
Yes. I’m not sure why you seem confused. The premise is churches should pay taxes. I’m not sure what you don’t understand about that. They should pay taxes. They are influencing people’s opinions on our politics and policies. They should pay taxes. They are influencing people in their weakest moments. They should pay taxes. Do you understand that I believe any religious institution should pay taxes? I hope you aren’t confused still.
Anarchist groups do the sane thing so Food Not Bombs should pay taxes then and do less charity.
All your leftist charities do everything you state churches are doing. Should your local mutual aide org get taxed because they influence people’s views?
The real issue here is your bigotry against churches.
Anarchist groups and leftist charities don’t make promises on the afterlife to people in need, do you not see how that is a problem?